Talk:Super Saiyan 4
SSJ4 as the real "SSJ2" Okay so Ridureyu, can you explain some backing on that, because I understand where your coming from but most of that is pure speculation? SSJGoku93 00:01, 25 September 2008 (UTC) Yeah, total speculation, but this is GT we're talking about. Didn't Broly have an action figure depicting him as a Super Saiyan 4? I mean, I know I saw at least one on ebay, even having an official packaging of it. It is on Ebay but that's those chinese unofficial toys. Also they're based off of Toyble's Legendary Super Saiyan 4 Broly. EchostreamFanJosh Not sure what you guys are talking about, but based on the chart on the Super Saiyan article, I would guess that SSJ4 is like "Great Ape SSJ2". Since the "Great Ape" is practically a different species from a regular Saiyan, it's reasonable to consider their Super Saiyan transformations as a separate "product line". That gives us "Saiyan/Great Ape", the base form; "Super Saiyan/Super Great Ape", which gives the fighter a massive power boost and changes their colors yellow; and "Super Saiyan 2/Super Great Ape 2", which gives the fighter longer than average hair (Super Great Ape 2 more so because it's a more powerful transformation). That's one way of looking at it, at least. BrentNewland 02:47, August 3, 2010 (UTC) '4' in Japanese I don't speak fluent Japanese but I'm familiar with numerous words in the language, and I always thought the romanized Japanese words for the number 4 were 'si' and 'yon', not 'fō'. Is this incorrect? Storm 09:06, 7 December 2008 (UTC) :Well, if this page is any indication, I'd say you're right. (First thing that came up when Googling.) I'll admit I'm also not a fluent speaker though. -- 09:51, 7 December 2008 (UTC) ::I noticed that page too while checking into it. Another thing that makes 'fō' questionable (to me anyways) is that Nuova Shenron's Japanese name is "Si Xīng Long" ("Four Star Dragon"). Storm 10:35, 7 December 2008 (UTC) :::Hmm. One thing I notice though is that the Romaji renditions of Super Saiyan 2 and Super Saiyan 3 also don't correspond to that numbering. It might be that those words are a different form of number, like 'second', 'third' and 'fourth' as opposed to 'two', 'three', and 'four'. Or something different entirely. I watched the Japanese dub of the episode where Goku ascends to SS4, and when Kibito Kai states the name of the transformation, and it does indeed sound like he's saying 'fō'. -- 00:12, 9 December 2008 (UTC) ::::I'm not a fluent speaker myself, but I know that second, third and fourth translate to 'Nidaime', 'Sandaime' and 'Yondaime', respectively. However, there is another way of saying Japanese nowadays, it's called Engrish. Japanese people tend to speak English words or phrases with their own accent. 'Fō' is most likely originating from there, it's Engrish for Four. --[[User:Dranzer Neos|'N'e'o's']] 19:19, 14 December 2008 (UTC) :::::Ah, that makes sense, thanks. I imagine that's where 'Supa' comes from too? Gosh, now maybe we need an 'Engrish' parameter in the translation template. LOL. -- 08:48, 16 December 2008 (UTC) ::::::Nah. Engrish is still Japanese. You don't need to make a new template. [[User:Dranzer Neos|'Ne'o's']] 09:48, 16 December 2008 (UTC) Transformations Um, I don't think SSJ4 Vegeta appears in Transformations considering it only goes to the end of the Baby saga but I've never played it so I don't want to edit anything without making sure. --Vatek 21:21, 30 January 2009 (UTC) Quote for Super Saiyan 4 If there is a quote for the article, please post it right there. If there isn't any, just remove it out of the article. Dekoshu talk 00:54, 24 February 2009 (UTC) :"At long last... I've ascended."'' - Vegeta after transforming to SSJ4. From the Funimation dub.-- bulletproof' 03:45, 24 February 2009 (UTC) ::Thank you, Bulletproof. What does Goku say when he achieved Super Saiyan 4? Dekoshu talk 03:58, 24 February 2009 (UTC) :::Goku? When he first tranformed? ...Nothing. He just smirks. '-- bulletproof' 06:50, 24 February 2009 (UTC) ::: I meant when ''Goku first transformed into Super Saiyan 4. Dekoshu talk 18:02, 24 February 2009 (UTC) ::::Yeah I mean he just smirked. '-- bulletproof' 21:13, 25 February 2009 (UTC) :::::Okay, he just smirked. But what about the quote Goku said? ::::::That's what Goku says in regards to the Super Saiyan 3 transformation. He doesn't say anything in regards to SS4. [[User:Vixen Windstorm|'Storm']] [[User talk:Vixen Windstorm|'talk']] –''' [[User:Vixen Windstorm#Projects|'''projects]] 21:36, 25 February 2009 (UTC) Appearance I would really like to know what the creators of GT were thinking when they designed Super Saiyan 4. Where did the red fur and all of that come from? --LocC 09 14:14, 1 March 2009 (UTC) In response, I believe they chose red simply because gold would be too much to look at. Super Saiyan Historian 16:52, December 24, 2009 (UTC) :Just my humble opinion, but I'll bet they were trying to make him look more like Sun Wukong (aka, the monkey king. Speaking of which, I added into the Trivia section that while it is called Super Saiyan 4, it's possible for even an untrained Super Saiyan to achieve it so long as they have a tail/blutz wave generator. I believe Dragonball has magic so it might be the reason why super saiyan 4 gets his red fur. (23:05, September 1, 2009 (UTC)) :I think Dragon Ball got magic, but I doubt that's what makes the red fur Dyas 14:04, September 2, 2009 (UTC) maybe a ss4 hint i was thinking maybe ss4 was hinted i nthe manga i mean frieza 4 forms cell 4 main forms buu 4 forms YOUE SEE 0_o yer so if anyone has anything to say.... 4 forms including there base form which would mean ss3 is gokus 4 form Colors In the infobox the colors has only red. Super Saiyan 4 has: red, maroon, black, brown. EchostreamFanJosh stronger than a golden ape it says that no info sudgests that it is stronger than a golden great ape but baby vegeta in normal form is stronger than goku(gt) in even super saiyan form is yet when golden great ape baby and ss4 goku are fighting they are eaqual and baby was in control so that means ss4 is stronger and has control. Wowfunny251andwowfunneyanderasa 05:49, March 16, 2010 (UTC) Concept Xaity 07:29, May 19, 2010 (UTC) I sew a SSJ4 concept in Deviantart or something and the concept looked like an upgranded version of SSJ3 (Like SSJ2 is a SSJ1 with lightings and spikier hair and SSJ3 is like a SSJ3 is a SSJ2 with longer hair). Is Toriama's concept looks like the true SSJ4 in DBGT or does it looks like what I mensioned? Xaity could you put the link on this page? It sounds interesting. Super Saiyan Historian 23:38, June 7, 2010 (UTC) :You can put the link, but please don't add the actual picture, no fan art 13:16, June 8, 2010 (UTC) Dumb Things People Have Done Its really smart to remember Dragon Ball Z facts when talking about Dragon Ball GT, like remembering that Vegeta can control the Great Ape Transformation and that he never turned Golen Great Ape straight away so the guy who says (after he finally gained control) should stop making that edit. And face the facts you cant always think your wrong k. :The great ape transformation is different than golden great ape. Remember when Goku had to use every bit of will power he had not to kill Gohan after going ss? Who's to say it's not the same thing? No speculation please. 01:15, August 5, 2010 (UTC) re3super saiyan 4 vegeta Can i add a new picture of Super Saiyan 4 vegeta? : The one that is there now is among the better ones on the Wiki, but if you have a better one, you are welcome to try it out. Just keep in mind that it very well may be reverted by the community. 21:19, August 29, 2010 (UTC) : : : how is this : : : I like the one all ready there because it does not show a beat up vegeta like this one does.THETRUESUPERSAIYAN 01:16, August 31, 2010 (UTC) : : : umm my bad i thought yall would like a beat up vegeta and goku for the thing : : : One question please... Does somebody know what will happen after the tail is removed as SSJ4? :Nobody knows as it was never shown in the series. Jeangabin666 20:44, July 5, 2011 (UTC) nothing would u could still go ssj4 rember it was stated u only need the requirements the first time u use the transformation does go still need 2 get angry no he does not u only need the requirements the first time after that u can go 2 the transformation any time u want.like does goku still need 2 go goled great ape 2 go 2 ssj 4 no that the only need for the tail and that is 2 go great ape and goku does not go great ape 2 go 2 ss4 so there is know need for the tail after the firdt time. :It is unknown. It has never been shown. Anyway anon. Your english is bearly understanble. I suppose you work on it. EntertainmentFan14 16:44, September 15, 2011 (UTC) ::Your english is bearly understanble. bearly understanble. understanble. And the irony. - 17:00, September 15, 2011 (UTC) ssj 4 is the actuall SSJ transformation, and What YOU CALL SSJ, SSJ2 and SSJ3 are merely stages in evolution to the Super Saiyan stage. its confusing 05:07, June 11, 2012 (UTC)I have a question and its been bothering me, is Gogeta allowed fo 10 minutes or 15 when he's a SSJ4? this page says 15 but gogeta's page says 10, i'm confused, please help me. 05:07, June 11, 2012 (UTC) What's SSj4's multiplier? How stronger is a Super Saiyan 4 than a Super Saiyan 3? The page says that you have to already be in your Super Saiyan or higher form and then access into your Golden Oozaru form. Does this mean that SSj4 multiplies base form only by 500? 'Cause if that were the case, then there's no way that SSj4 is stronger than Baby Vegeta.Disasters GoOn (talk) 23:50, August 21, 2012 (UTC)Disasters GoOn Trivia one fake information - SS4 IS the Super Saiyan level. This inforamtion downside of the Trivia is the GT-heiters fantasies :This? "Super Saiyan forms 1-3 have gold hair, and the Super Saiyan 4 form does not. This is explained in the Dragon Ball GT Perfect Files: the Super Saiyan 4 form is not a Super Saiyan form but an evolution in the Saiyan physiology that takes the greatest traits from the Great Ape and the regular Saiyan form." 16:51, February 23, 2013 (UTC) :Yes--[[User:SuperSaiyanDate|'Date']] 17:12, February 23, 2013 (UTC) ::I've reverted it back. 18:12, February 23, 2013 (UTC) SSJ4 is non-canon Super Saiyan 4 can't exist because Super Saiyans don't have tails (in the manga atleast). 1. The last time Goku's tail regenrated was when he was around 13. 2. Gohan achieved SSJ at the age of 10 and his tail never grew back again. Goku's tail been returned in GT--[[User:SuperSaiyanDate|'Date']] 11:43, March 14, 2013 (UTC) Really? It could vary depeneding on the Saiyan. Besides, Goku was 12 years old when he became a kid. And from doing special training, he was able to regrow his tail. And Super Saiyans don't have tails because their tails were REMOVED before they achieved SSJ. Are you seriously implying it's impossible for Super Saiyans to have Tails? 14:10, March 14, 2013 (UTC) Super Saiyans can't have a tail? 00:40, March 16, 2013 (UTC) :That's so weird. I was kind of under the impression that being Super Saiyan and Great Ape were the only requirements for Golden Great Ape, and then having mental control over your Great Ape form made you Super Saiyan 4. Bardock is a champ. 05:25, March 16, 2013 (UTC) SS4 Great Ape I added picture of SS4 Great Ape Goku. Don't remove it and you can edit it. Gohan Can Gohan acess this from if he gets bis tail back. Then, its power would be humongous. 16:16, March 23, 2013 (UTC) :Maybe if he trains a lot more and goes someplace with a moon. 23:44, March 23, 2013 (UTC) What name was the creator SSJ4? Mistake! *Goku's variation is the first to be seen. When he transforms into a Super Saiyan 4, he has scarlet red fur on the top half of his body, his hair turns black, and his eyes change to golden-yellow. *Goku's variation is the first to be seen. When he transforms into a Super Saiyan 4, he has scarlet red fur on the top half of his body, his hair REMAINS black, and his eyes change to golden-yellow. :Done! Thanks. 11:50, December 2, 2013 (UTC) :To be perfectly techinical, Goku's hair DOES turn black the first time he goes SSJ4, as it was gold due to his Super Oozaru form up to that point. Rui Usagi (talk) 04:47, January 8, 2014 (UTC) Technicalities Is it ever explicitly stated that SSJ4 overwhelms Black Star Dragonball wishes? Or is it just as possible that SSJ4 causes the user's body to take on a form best suited for expressing their power, their physical prime? Rui Usagi (talk) 04:51, January 8, 2014 (UTC) :A combination of both, but I wouldn't say ss4 form has the power to overcome a wish made with the black star dragonballs other than that concerning the body and the form itself. Prassy90 (talk) 13:18, January 8, 2014 (UTC) It may depend on the wish itself. Yes, SS4 Goku overwhelms the Black Stat Dragon Ball wish to make him young, regardless of whether the reason is that he started old or that he is best suited for fighting with an older body. Yes, this technically means that wishes can be overcome, but it is not a sure thing that all wishes can be overcome. For instance, if the Earth is destroyed by a wish and all the humans die, Goku might struggle to be able to reverse that. He has revived animals and we have seen characters create matter... but this is a huge scale for Goku. 01:54, January 9, 2014 (UTC) The Multiplier On this page it says that "In Dragon Ball Z: Scouter Battle Taikan Kamehameha, Super Saiyan 4 is 10x a regular Super Saiyan in power (matching the 10x Kamehameha multiplier) so what would the SSJ4 Multipler be then? :Can't you do the math? 00:52, February 22, 2015 (UTC) :I dd and i came up with multiply therios like x10,x50,x60 and x500,so i came here to see if any of those were right and if not to see what the multiplier is...... HybridSaiyan (talk) 00:56, February 22, 2015 (UTC) Super Saiyan 4 = Oozaru 2? So..This may sound stupid, hell, someone could've thought about this before but..I don't think SSJ4 is actually SSJ4. What I mean is..Well. I think the levels of Super Saiyan make their hair longer and in turn boost their power and drain more energy.. Nooww. Super Saiyan God..That's a different story altogether..So I'm leaving that out. But Super Saiyan 4..Well. It doesn't seem to drain power as much as 3, it doesn't make the hair longer..But it does make them stronger. Now..Oozaru raises a saiyans energy by around..10x if I remember right, I honestly see SSJ4 as more of a evolved Oozaru or Oozaru 2 if anything. If you think about it, the other forms have no great ape transformation and body hair like that..Maybe it's just the next form of a Oozaru and the power boost could be around 50 or a 100 or so. Welp, just my thoughts. ShenIsADick (talk) 05:14, April 13, 2015 (UTC) :The form is linked strongly to Oozaru (need to achieve Golden Oozaru first, need a tail) and has some advantages over SS3. 06:46, April 13, 2015 (UTC) That's my point. If you pay attention, SSJ3(Even SSJ2 sorta) drains the users energy EXTREMELY quickly, SSJ4 though, Goku can hold that as if it was a Super Saiyan transformation or even not a transformation at all..Just a different form. ShenIsADick (talk) 19:21, April 13, 2015 (UTC) Super Saiyan 4? To be a SS4, you need a tail and the ability to transform into a Super Saiyan. If you don't have SS2 or SS3, are you really a Super Saiyan 4? Meshack (talk) 19:00, July 30, 2015 (UTC) :Vegeta doesnt have SS3 (in the anime) but has SS4. 19:04, July 30, 2015 (UTC) :no but we know what ss3 is Meshack (talk) 19:06, July 30, 2015 (UTC) SSJ4 is not that much stronger than SSJ3 According to my calculations SSJ4 is only 1.25x stronger than SSJ3. It is simple; Goku in SSJ3 has a power level of 1 200 000 000 which is 400x stronger than his base form which is 3 000 000. SSJ4 is 10x stronger than SSJ1 which is 150 000 000. So that means SSJ4 is 500x more powerful than Goku's base form. Therefore Goku's power level is 1 500 000 000 in SSJ4. So you divide 1 500 000 000 / 1 200 000 000 which gives you 1.25. To check that you do simply 1 200 000 000 x 1.25 which is 1 500 000 000. Which means SSJ4 is only 1.25x stronger than SSJ3. Question Is the Super Saiyan 4 actually a Super Saiyan?--Hulk10 (talk) 22:18, May 9, 2016 (UTC) :While its appearence isn't very similar to the other SSJ forms, SSJ4 is definitely a Super Saiyan form. -- 22:30, May 9, 2016 (UTC) Yeah I'd agree with that Final Chidori.--Hulk10 (talk) 22:36, May 9, 2016 (UTC) Super Saiyan 4 Transformation Line In The Page It Says That Super Saiyan 4 Is Not Part Of The Core Transformations Of Super Saiyan (1-3). This Makes It Its Own Transformation And Not Have Predecessors Such As Super Saiyan 3, Due To The Fact That If Super Saiyan 3 Was A Predecessor, They Would Transform From 3 To 4, And Not From Base To 4. PS: Even In The Bottom Where It Lists All The Forms Under The Saiyan Title, SSJ4 Is Separate, And Not In Line With 1-3. Bob1200 (talk) 10:19, May 10, 2016 (UTC) Kanzenshu has a translation of what GT prefect files says "Super Saiyan 4 The form which draws out the battle power which Saiyans posses out to the utmost limits is this, Super Saiyan 4!! It’s distinguished by having a different appearance than previous Super Saiyans, with red body fur and long black hair!! It is called Super Saiyan 4 out of convenience, but due to it being a transformation from Golden Oozaru, it would be no exaggeration to call it a different species from all previous Super Saiyans!! Thinking of it as a different species, you could also name such points as the fact that unlike with 3 he has an adult appearance, despite being a transformation of little Goku." doesn't say that it is a different form at all. Except It Says Right On The Super Saiyan 4 Page On The Wikia That It IS A Separate Form. Bob1200 (talk) 10:25, May 10, 2016 (UTC)